Suzuki returning to USA

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Ronzuki
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That works for me. Suzuki reliability means I really won't need Toyota's (or anyone elses) service. Perfect, win-win. I'll pay a little more for that as long as it's a real zuk. Don't care about the badge. Put a 'bulbous T' on the front of a Jimny and I'm most definitely cool with it.
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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KuroNekko
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Location: California, USA

Thinking about it, I think the only Suzuki-Toyota joint vehicle that could come to the US would be the next gen replacement for the Grand Vitara. It makes sense for many reasons. First, it's Suzuki's oldest model now and really needs a replacement. It's also large enough for the US market and is also closer to a real SUV though it has a unibody. It's really like a mini Jeep Grand Cherokee in design because it has a unibody but with a ladder structure at its core and has a 4x4 system instead of AWD. It's in between a body-on-frame truck-based 4x4 SUV and a unibody car-based AWD CUV. Toyota doesn't have a vehicle like and has shown interest in offering a smaller and cheaper 4x4 given they only have CUVs with AWD at the size and price range. The Jimny is way too small and too underpowered for most US consumers not to mention there is no way Suzuki can make the Jimny meet US crash specs. It's crash test ratings as is is already questionable as the recent tests have shown. However, it's a tiny BOF vehicle intended to be driven at lower speeds, especially offroad. It was never designed for the speeds commonly driven in countries like the US and Canada.
Hence, I think of all the vehicles Suzuki can build for/with Toyota, it would be the next replacement for the GV.
2011 Suzuki Kizashi Sport GTS 6MT (Black)
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Ronzuki
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KuroNekko wrote: It's really like a mini Jeep Grand Cherokee in design because it has a unibody but with a ladder structure at its core and has a 4x4 system instead of AWD. It's in between a body-on-frame truck-based 4x4 SUV and a unibody car-based AWD CUV.

Hence, I think of all the vehicles Suzuki can build for/with Toyota, it would be the next replacement for the GV.
meh...had a 4-door kick...meh...boring...ifs...most have/had alum front diff housings....not rugged enough in stock form for my tastes...why bother....nuther me-too SUV. Jimny too small, too slow...that's what everyone said in 86 until Samurais started quickly kicking Wrangler ass in unit sales at a fraction of the price of a true Heep. Toyota needs to build or rebadge something, anything, w/ solid axles full body on a boxed frame to dethrone Jeep Junk. As far as the BS gov safety standards that jack vehicle purchase and repair numbers to the stratosphere....ask me if I care.
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/adas ... pair-cost/
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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KuroNekko
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Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 5:08 pm
Location: California, USA

Ronzuki wrote:
meh...had a 4-door kick...meh...boring...ifs...most have/had alum front diff housings....not rugged enough in stock form for my tastes...why bother....nuther me-too SUV. Jimny too small, too slow...that's what everyone said in 86 until Samurais started quickly kicking Wrangler ass in unit sales at a fraction of the price of a true Heep. Toyota needs to build or rebadge something, anything, w/ solid axles full body on a boxed frame to dethrone Jeep Junk. As far as the BS gov safety standards that jack vehicle purchase and repair numbers to the stratosphere....ask me if I care.
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/adas ... pair-cost/
I had a 4 door Sidekick and liked it. Yes, not as hardcore as a vehicle with dual solid axles, but the reality is that it went everywhere a stock Samurai could. I know because I usually offroaded with a buddy in a stock Samurai. However, the Sidekick with the IFS made the vehicle much better for daily driving and higher speed handling. This is why I don't really care for solid axles as their only real strength is in rock crawling. They are actually far worse for higher speed offroading hence faster offroaders like the Ford Raptor use IFS instead of solid axles. Personally, I like trail driving for adventure more than specifically rock-crawling and need a vehicle that can be daily driven while also serving as an adventure vehicle. Hence, IFS actually appeals to me more than dual solid axles. The reality is that rock-crawling doesn't definite all offroad driving and is really just a form of it.

While I really like the new Jimny, I think Toyota and Suzuki would do better for sales with a slightly larger vehicle that's more practical for daily driving. If they can make something in between the Jimny and the GV, that would probably appeal to many. Having a BOF with solid axles would also make the vehicle more pricey, especially if designed for US crash specs and consumer tastes. Look at the prices Wranglers go for.

As for safety, there are standards for the general public but I agree that some vehicles can't be expected to meet high standards. I personally see the Jimny as something between a motorcycle and passenger car in terms of expectations of safety. It should be inherent that a very small traditional SUV with a body-on-frame construction is a purpose-built vehicle that by inherent design can not meet the highest crash safety standards. It was literally not designed to drive on paved roads at higher speeds but to excel offroad at much lower speeds with low risk of collisions with other vehicles.
2011 Suzuki Kizashi Sport GTS 6MT (Black)
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Ronzuki
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IFS has a much higher long-term cost of ownership. If one is actually going to use it for what it was truly designed for. All the ifs Toyotas I ever wheeled with back in the day were ALL fully SAS'd after there was essentially nothing worth a damn left intact on the front suspensions. Too many flimsy moving parts, bushings, alignments after the slightest little bang you name it. And mud packed in to those bushings and joints...bad. Watched the wheels on those things do some funny stuff when attempting to steer traversing ruts and logs. Forget playing in the rocks with ifs, that's just asking to ruin everybody's day.

Never had to align my 85 Toyota pick-up (last of the solids) or either of my Samurais. ifs 92 Sidekick yes, 91 twin I-beam Explorer yes, 94 3/4 ton ifs suburban yes. The only vehicles ever off-roaded...the Toyota and the first Samurai mildly (both DDers), the last Samurai wheeled abusively and was also driven to and from the abuse for many years. The remainders were pavement pounders only.

IDK, round here folks sure do dig their Super-Duty solid=axled big-ole pavement pounders tooling down the highway blowing by me many days. If something can hold up to rock banging abuse, then its pretty much going to survive a very long time, problem free, traversing the roadways. Like I said, somebody needs to challenge the solid axle Wrangler again. Don't need anymore me=too SUVs. Plenty of them to wade through.
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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KuroNekko
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Location: California, USA

I agree that solid axles are the best for durability. They just aren't that great at high speed handling or even stability. It's a trade-off for better offroad performance and durability. Given that I'd be driving a vehicle on-road most of the time, I'm unwilling to compromise too much road-performance. After all, I'd be driving the vehicle to the adventure instead of towing it there. I like the idea of a vehicle that is competent in most aspects instead of being just an ace in only a few regards, especially if the vehicle is going to be my only vehicle and one I also commute in.

That being said, I think we agree that we just want something rough and ready from Suzuki regardless of the badge it wears. While I would love something like a Jimny which is like a baby Wrangler, I think maybe a vehicle like a baby 4Runner may appeal to more people in the US.
Also, as much as I'd love an offroader from Suzuki, I'd be thrilled to get something like a Swift too. Suzuki just makes great stuff in smaller packages.
2011 Suzuki Kizashi Sport GTS 6MT (Black)
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KuroNekko
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"No comment."
An article on the topic of Suzuki ever coming back to the US and offering the Jimny:
https://www.autoblog.com/2018/10/02/suz ... o-comment/
2011 Suzuki Kizashi Sport GTS 6MT (Black)
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Ronzuki
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Location: Lancaster County, PA

Comment...

Me thinks they're leery of another Heep inspired, targeted assassination, Consumer Union repeat of the utterly Bullsh|t, yet successful, Samurai smear campaign. Successful because Americans instantly believe hype and that's all one needs to destroy something...or nowadays, somebody.

Let's face it, Suzuki doesn't need America's pain in the azz market share. None of the commenters of the article gets that simple reality. Only hope is a rebadged Toyota Jimny and that's entirely up to Toyota.

Two totally laughable jokes also mentioned in the comments of an article about superior machine that has absolute zero similarity to: 1) the "new" Ford Bronco (in name only) and 2) Chevy Blazer.
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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KuroNekko
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Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 5:08 pm
Location: California, USA

Yeah, I don't have hope for Suzuki coming back too even with spiked interest in the brand due to the new Jimny. Suzuki specializes in small vehicles and America is currently on a "bigger is better" trend with CUVs and SUVs in focus. If Toyota was to bring something over, it would have to be bigger so I think the next Grand Vitara would be the only thing they could collaborate on that both companies could sell in various markets. Suzuki kept the Jimny traditional while they made the Vitara a full CUV. What they will do with the old GV is still unknown it seems especially since the GV and Vitara seemed to diverge.

As for the upcoming Bronco and Blazer, I agree they aren't comparable to a Jimny. The new Bronco will essentially be the new old-style Ford Explorer; an SUV based on the Ranger. From what I can tell, it will be like a USDM version of the Ford Everest which has been offered in other countries, much like the Ranger, for a while. It should be a more traditional SUV but not like the original Bronco or the Wrangler.

The new Chevy Blazer is a CUV in every way. I've read it's GM's answer to the Ford Edge and Nissan Murano. I do like the looks of the new Blazer though.

Image
2011 Suzuki Kizashi Sport GTS 6MT (Black)
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Ronzuki
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Yes sir, that's a CUV travesty. Call it something else...that ain't no blazer.
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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