KuroNekko wrote: ↑Wed Jan 22, 2025 7:59 pm
I totally agree that Toyotas seem to largely sell themselves on a perceived reputation. Their actual cars are definitely behind the curve in design, driving experience, and refinement but Toyotas have generally better reliability and definitely a consumer base that believes they are superior as a brand. However, if you really look at them, most Toyotas with solid reliability reputations are basic and on dated designs. The 4Runner is a prime example. These are popular and the fanbase rave about the reliability but it's a 15-year-old design with a V6 and 5 speed auto. It performs like a 4 cylinder and drinks fuel like an 8 per many owners. I think anyone making the same car for that long with a dated powertrain can make a very reliable vehicle. Their new Tacoma and Tundra are having multiple issues stemming from an all-new design. It goes to show Toyota is not inherently gifted in engineering and when they have all-new products, they need to work out issues just like everyone else.
As for the Subaru Hybrid system, yes, it's set to be released on the Crosstrek and Forester soon. I considered it but the reality is there are two big concerns for me. The first is that it's all-new as a powertrain thus it can be expected they need to work out issues. The second is that Subaru is using their own engine. I've had two Subarus in the past and from experience, don't see the merit in a boxer design. In age, they are harder to maintain and more expensive to repair compared to an inline. In contrast, the Mazda CX-50 borrowed the
entire Toyota RAV4 Hybrid powertrain. Everything from the engine to the rear electric motor comes from Toyota. At least this system is not new and has an excellent reputation. Also, I don't know details regarding the Subaru boxer mated to the hybrid system but Toyota's engines for their traditional hybrids run an Atkinson cycle for greater efficiency. While the new Toyota trucks and SUVs are iffy, their CUVs and cars are solid and the RAV4 Hybrid has a solid reputation for the powertrain. However, I simply don't want a RAV4. Everyone has them, including literally my own brother. It's a great vehicle and actually offers more features for the money than rivals I'm considering. I just can't get myself to buy one due to their ubiquitous nature. This is why the CX-50 Hybrid is so enticing for me. It's the same powertrain but in a different body and a chassis that is better for handling. Additionally, there is less dealer markup and waiting due to the fact far more people are buying the RAV4 simply for the Toyota branding.
As for the Outlander PHEV, I used to like it a lot more in the past. I now think it fell behind and lost the unique advantage it once had as the first AWD PHEV CUV. While the PHEV system is neat, once the battery depletes, the hybrid mode returns fuel economy no better than the regular ICE version. Many PHEVs are like this except for the RAV4 Prime PHEV. The Prime actually is able to get hybrid-like efficiency even when the battery depletes in EV mode. The problem is the Prime is a $50K RAV4.
I've been waiting a while for an ideal hybrid CUV to come along and I think finally, there are some enticing models. The release of the CX-50 Hybrid a few months ago is basically what I was waiting for ever since the CX-50 debuted. The RAV4 Hybrid Woodland is also available, which is enticing for the price. It's basically a RAV4 Hybrid with the RAV4 TRD's shocks, tires, and wheels for more capable off-pavement travel. While an offroad version does seem odd for a hybrid, I'm the kind to get out there on the trails in a vehicle. Learning to drive on a mountain and frequently offroading in my teens and twenties, I learned the limits pretty early on and realized even an AWD CUV would take me to most places I'd care to go if rock-crawling was not the destination. A dedicated 4x4 vehicle is best but comes with huge drawbacks in price, practicality, and road handling for an everyday vehicle. I considered the upcoming new Honda Passport Trailsport but it looks like Honda is not offering a powertrain other than the V6 any time soon. I just don't need that kind of power and definitely want a vehicle more fuel efficient than the Kizashi, not less.
I will start lurking around dealerships soon and see how I actually like certain models in person. I love my Kizashi, which is running perfectly fine, but I think it's time I move on soon to a vehicle that better suits my life now.
I’m glad you pointed that out about Toyota’s reputation based on tried and true products versus their genuinely new technology that’s at least as problematic as every other shiny new thing (same goes for Mazda’s brand new powertrains, to be fair). The 3.4L TT that originally debuted in the Lexus LS was said to be a horrendously complicated engine, and that was before anything ever went wrong with it. I think the SUVs and trucks were developed by Toyota’s American division, so there’s that. I think BMW is in the same boat, resting on their laurels as the “ultimate driving machine,” when folks like Cadillac take their lunch with their Blackwing models.
But anyway, that Corolla rental really got under my skin haha. The first one I had years ago is mostly forgettable, which isn’t entirely a bad thing. I remember it being an easygoing experience. But this new one, while still livable (especially with better tires), felt so illogical in a surprising number of places. Maybe the last one did, too, because back then I didn’t pay attention to ergonomics and vehicle logic.
For starters, for some reason Toyota decided to give automatic down/up windows to ALL FOUR doors, on the
base trim, and didn’t advertise that fact to anyone. There’s nothing on the actual switches to denote all four work that way, only the driver’s. I figure most people will accidentally stumble upon this at some point in the ownership experience.
The steering wheel buttons are all part of an amorphous shape, so it’s almost impossible to tell which one your thumb is over, at least when first starting out with the car. Meanwhile, other automakers create their steering wheel buttons with deep grooves or separate them altogether, so you don’t make that mistake. And the actual layout of the cruise control buttons is nonsensical compared to how other cars I’ve driven do it. It’s good they moved away from that awkward extra stalk below the wiper stalk, but the execution was still terrible.
Speaking of things the Corolla hasn’t moved from is the trunk/fuel access switch, which is still on the floor next to the seat. Once you learn where it is, it’s fine, but it just seems so archaic. Love that they do luxuries like the auto down/up for all windows, but not design a more modern trunk/fuel door release.
What’s not archaic is the parking brake automatically activates when you put the car in Park, and also deactivates on its own when you take it out of Park; this may seem like “the future,” but to me it’s instilling a bad habit of not paying attention to the state of your parking brake. I can totally see someone going from this to a car without it and forgetting to set it because that second car doesn’t do it automatically.
The way that Toyota has championed automated safety measures but doesn’t include Blind Spot Monitor on the base trim, yet includes more advanced systems, is beyond me. Old-school drivers like to poo-poo on BSM, but the Corolla’s mirrors are smaller than the Kizashi or Mazda3’s and the rearward view is awful due to the tall headrests that are fixed in place, like on the Camry. I literally drove with the backseats folded down for two weeks because of this. The previous Corolla’s rear headrests were also tall, but were at least removable. And yes, I spent that rental period with them removed lol. The Mazda3 has low headrests so that’s never been an issue for me. One underrated thing about the Kizashi was the folding rear headrest. I didn’t know they folded until I checked out the Kizashi I later bought. My first thought was “crap these headrests are tall, I can hardly see out back.”
As for powertrain, well, the 2.0L makes decent grunt on paper, but it felt slower than the 1.8L I had last time. I thought that the CVT with the real first gear might be the future of CVTs, but it really didn’t work that smooth. It seemed like the worst of both worlds, clunky to start and not very eager to deliver power after that. At least most other Toyotas get real gearboxes, but I’ve heard mixed feedback on Aisins. To be honest, I didn’t mind the JATCO in most situations, and I would probably take it over the current Corolla’s CVT. That Rogue Sport rental you had a while back was probably the closest you’ve been to driving a JATCO Kizashi; I recall your overall impression was positive, but do you remember how you felt about the CVT?
There are some other gripes I have, but I’m just saying all this to elaborate on why I don’t have faith in Toyotas, if their other vehicles are so illogically designed in this manner.
Speaking of hybrids, a day after my previous post, I saw a Car & Driver article about spy shots of the next CX-5, which will be hybridized with Mazda’s technology. I’m hoping it’s executed better than the CX-90/70 hybrid, which is said to be rather clunky. I think the MX-30 hybrid sold elsewhere turned out okay (wish we got that here), so I have some faith in Mazda’s hybridization efforts. But I agree that Toyota’s the master at it, and there’s no one better to lift a hybrid powertrain from if you want a tried and true, unobtrusive system that will work for a long time.
I love how the CX-50 looks, the low but wide stance feels so unique in its class of blobby CUVs. I heard the hybrid powertrain uses the previous generation Toyota system, but high 30s MPGs is still nothing to sneeze at. I think the hybrid is only on one trim, but if they added it to the soft-roading Meridian trim, that could be something interesting.
I've owned this MY 2011 since summer of 2012. I love this car and it's served me wonderfully but I have simply outgrown it and need a different type of vehicle to better suit my life now. It's taken me a while to concede it's time to let it go and move on. It will be the last sedan, last manual transmission, and last conventional ICE vehicle I'll buy and drive as a daily driver. (It's okay, I have a project car and a motorcycle.) As sad and hard as it's going to be to part with the Kizashi, the upside is that my nephew is very interested in it. He seriously wants a manual transmission sedan and is finding that most used models are overpriced and not in good condition. I also know he's liked my Kizashi even before he started learning to drive. Now that it's the new year, I guess it's time I start the process of getting the replacement and letting the Kizashi go. Sadly, this is my 2025 plan for the Kizashi.
