TSB SI-0007 WHEEL ALIGNMENT SPECS

[smsmart]

Quick update on my situation:

Went to the dealer on MLK day...told them about the creaking/squeaking of the suspension and the crap steering that started when they aligned the vehicle. Of course--as luck would have it--the steering was better performing that day (more stable feeling, less prone to bump steer) so they said they couldn't find anything wrong with that--and as to the creaking/squeaking...they couldn't reproduce that problem either. :go figure:

All they ended up doing was greasing up the swaybar bushings...which hasn't improved anything. Steering still crap and creaks/squeaks still there. Dealer also told me that if I wanted to, I could leave the car with them for a few days so they can drive it around more to reproduce the problems I'm reporting--that is, if they have a loaner available. Of course, they don't have a loaner available (aka don't bother).

Afterwards, I had a funny conversation with the service adviser... (first off, I should mention that the service manager was the person who handled the car and spoke to the mechanic, not the adviser himself). After getting the paperwork and car back, I asked the adviser what the deal was with them not finding anything wrong with the car. He quickly grabbed my paperwork from me and took half a minute to read what was written there (since he didn't write the report). He then proceeded to explain that they couldn't get the car to do anything wrong, blah blah blah, so they can't fix anything. I said "sure, I understand that." But then I asked about the power steering and whether they tried checking if it was functioning properly. He tells me "everything is fine because the mechanic didn't find any power steering fluid leaking..." So I had to break the news to him...the car doesn't have hydraulic power steering, so of course there wasn't any fluid leaking. Of course he then back-tracked and said "oh, yeah, yeah, yeah." Then I asked him if they then tried hooking up the Suzuki diagnostic tool to see if the EPS sensors were properly calibrated, if the EPS was getting the right voltage, etc. Of course he replies with "oh yeah, definitely, they didn't find anything wrong." How does he know?? He didn't even know what they did to the car until he read the report he grabbed from me!

Oh, and btw... Ball Kia/Mitsu/Suzuki in National City, CA...I'm looking at you!

[murcod]

Sad and frustrating for you, but I guess it's not surprising.

The same thing happened to me when I reported front end noises- I got it back the same and was told "unable to replicate and everything's fine!!!" I get the impression they don't want to spend the time fault finding such issues because (perhaps) they can't bill it to Suzuki unless they do find a hard failure?

[SamirD]

I'm also seeing rather worrisome cracking in the side tread of my OEM Dunlops despite them not being all that worn out. These original tires do not even have 25,000 miles on them. I agree with others that these OEM tires are not great. I won't be replacing them with the same tires for sure.

Cracking isn't normal by any means. I would get in touch with Dunlop and see what they will do about this. I know Suzuki won't do anything as I've already talked to them about the wear because of the alignment (aka their bad alignment ruined the tires so they should be liable).

I would be extra alert for anything that feels funny on your tires. One of our minivans had a bad vibration once when I got on the highway. I know the front tires were old and cracked (but the tread was still good). Luckily I pulled over--half the tire was 3" higher than the rest because the steel belt separated. It would have been a very bad blowout.

[SamirD]

How does he know?? He didn't even know what they did to the car until he read the report he grabbed from me!

Oh, and btw... Ball Kia/Mitsu/Suzuki in National City, CA...I'm looking at you!

This is why if I have to talk to anyone, I just walk back into the back and talk to the technician who is working on the car (usually when he's doing it). Then you can talk the talk with the person who knows what the hell you're talking about.

Service advisors and managers are as scummy as used car sales a lot of times, just trying to upsell bogus jobs to ignorant people. I once saw a service advisor sell 3 brake jobs to people by stating the rotors weren't within spec. Perfectly good rotors thrown away--more waste and pollution. But he made them more revenue.

[SamirD]

I get the impression they don't want to spend the time fault finding such issues because (perhaps) they can't bill it to Suzuki unless they do find a hard failure?

I think it's because they know they're not good enough to find the issues, and hence can't bill anything to Suzuki.

Serves them right if they can't find it, but how does that help us when there's a problem with the car? This happens with every manufacturer, so it's not only Suzuki. My buddy was an Aston Martin tech and they had a clutch problem on the Vanquish where it would fail in under 1000 miles. It was a 40hr job to remove the entire drivetrain and torque tube and replace the clutch, but warranty didn't pay for it completely, so he quit the dealership.

[smsmart]

I'm wondering if I should just try doing another alignment...seeing as how my steering problems started when the dealership did an alignment over a year ago. Maybe it's still an alignment issue that no one has figured out? And besides, I figure that I'm probably due for another alignment anyway.

Anyway, has anyone ever had any experience with a shop that does not do alignments using computerized alignment machines? There's a shop in town that specializes in alignments and seems to be well recommended and has good Yelp reviews, but they supposedly do alignments the old-school way. I'm thinking of giving them a shot, but I wonder how precise their alignments are given that they don't use all the whiz-bang lasers and computers to measure

[Ronzuki]

Yes, 30+ years ago. Old-school tech-less alignments, done by someone who takes their time and who truly understands suspension geometry and how it works, can't be beat by the high tech racks. Equaled maybe, but not beat. The difficulty is finding that someone anymore. The laser racks just make it easier (faster). Calibration and care of any rack ($$) is key. If cal. isn't done, you might as well eye-ball it up in your own driveway....you'll get similar results. Treatment/neglect of the rack is also a problem. Too many shops use their alignment rack as another service lift because it's there taking up a bay in their shop. Not designed for that sort of abuse and will quickly become a source of bad alignments.

[~tc~]

Old-school tech-less alignments, done by someone who takes their time and who truly understands suspension geometry and how it works, can't be beat by the high tech racks. Equaled maybe, but not beat. The difficulty is finding that someone anymore.

X2 - you need an alignment technician, not an alignment machine operator

[murcod]

Anyway, has anyone ever had any experience with a shop that does not do alignments using computerized alignment machines? There's a shop in town that specializes in alignments and seems to be well recommended and has good Yelp reviews, but they supposedly do alignments the old-school way. I'm thinking of giving them a shot, but I wonder how precise their alignments are given that they don't use all the whiz-bang lasers and computers to measure

That's exactly the place you need. Take the alignment specs in and talk to them about the problems you've got.

[SamirD]

That's exactly the place you need. Take the alignment specs in and talk to them about the problems you've got.

And let us know how it turns out!